EGG on the Sulaco

Terraformer

How in God's (Engineer's) green earth did it get on board the Sulaco?

Bishop couldn't have planted it because as soon as he left the dropship he was chopped in two. The alien Queen was in the dropship and never went wondering around the Sulaco, it was hunting for Nute.

Seriously. Give me a solid explanation. Was there two eggs? because one impregnated ripley and then the cattle/dog got raped. was it some super facehugger?

or was it just simply an illogical milking cash grab invented by FOX just to keep the franchise going without logic or explanation?

John_Stark

I think the colonial marines game will actually explain that.

They sort of hinted at it by saying that they were the bridge between aliens and alien3, weyland will be involved and the derelict ship will be studied by weyland inc.

And they said to expect big surprises and familiar faces.

Brian_O_Blivion

I simply put it down to lack of design continuity, when I watch the film I imagine that the Queen pinched an egg off inside of the landing gear of the drop ship (even though it doesn't really resemble the inside of such a thing and seems more like a ship corridor) that grew full to full size then hatched on their way home. It's shame it's not consistent visually with Aliens, but what can you do? It's the same thing with the design of the stasis tubes, they look nothing like the ones in Aliens. I've read Fincher wanted to reference the design in Alien more so that's why it was chosen. I don't know if that's true or not but I've seen that bandied about a few times on the internet.

I still think it's a really nice opening title sequence.

Bug_Stomper

Yes, it is indeed a great opening sequence but the location of the egg and how it was onboard is always troublesome. Ripley doesn't even quiz Bishop about it when she gets him partially up and running on Fury 161:

Imagined dialogue:

Ripley: "Was there an Alien on board?"
Bishop: "Yes"
Ripley (slightly aghast): "How?"
Bishop gives a brief explanation......

@Brian - yes, the landing gear and the Queen carrying an 'emergency egg' inside her was the only semi-logical explanation but I have to agree, the shot with the egg looked like it was lodged in a corridor or the crew changing room! Perhaps Fincher wanted to put his own spin on the interior look of the Dropship (what little we see of it)? This might also go the same way with the cryotubes.

SargeISdead

I think the only "Plausible" explanation is the Queen still had an egg inside her after the egg-sac was blasted to smithereens and somehow managed to carry it with her through LV-426 and up to the Sulaco. As for the face hugger, I believe it's written in the life cycle somwhere(not sure if canon) that a Face Hugger in a new area with no other Xenos can somehow sense that and produces two eggs, a queen, and a drone to protect the queen while it matures inside the host. I think that was explained in the books in addition to a lone drone having the capability to turn into a Queen if neccessary to continue the species.

Honestly though I thought it was crap and a huge plot hole. I also don't think they can explain it with Colonial Marines since they are basically writing that as if ALIEN 3 never happened. I mean they find the Sulaco still in orbit around LV-426, nowhere near Fury 161 so that in itself is another big time plot hole if you go by the film. Also the Sulaco is apparently stock full of eggs and full grown xenos...considering no crew was left aboard, how is that even possible? I am highly skeptical of ALIENS: CM as being a canon part of the ALIEN lore as it appears they are already bending so much, including LV-426 having standing structures at the center of a thermo-nuclear blast, lol. As Bishop said, "Cloud of dust the size of Nebraska" there is no way the installation would still have sturctures that intact. I look forward to it (already pre-ordered it) as a game and a fun installment in the series, but I am not going to regard it as canon despite what Fox says after seeing the majority of the preview videos.

John_Stark

SargeISdead said:

Honestly though I thought it was crap and a huge plot hole. I also don't think they can explain it with Colonial Marines since they are basically writing that as if ALIEN 3 never happened. I mean they find the Sulaco still in orbit around LV-426, nowhere near Fury 161 so that in itself is another big time plot hole if you go by the film. Also the Sulaco is apparently stock full of eggs and full grown xenos...considering no crew was left aboard, how is that even possible? I am highly skeptical of ALIENS: CM as being a canon part of the ALIEN lore as it appears they are already bending so much, including LV-426 having standing structures at the center of a thermo-nuclear blast, lol. As Bishop said, "Cloud of dust the size of Nebraska" there is no way the installation would still have sturctures that intact. I look forward to it (already pre-ordered it) as a game and a fun installment in the series, but I am not going to regard it as canon despite what Fox says after seeing the majority of the preview videos.

No, they talked about how the sulaco has returned from last being seen around fiorina 161.

Just wait, you'll see. Weyland was responsible for this. Well the company, not the man.

They have made their research, just pay attention to this:

John_Stark

Oh yeah, remember when we were talking about story and the egg on the sulaco and the ship being on fury 161....well check this out, will blow your brains out:

http://uk.ign.com/videos/2012/12/26/aliens-colonial-marines-story-trailer

SargeISdead

Yeah I just watched that on the CM thread and honestly I'm even more confused now about the game and how they are going to tie it in to ALIENS and the series in general. From the look of things the crew on the Sephora already knows about the xenos before they get there, at least that's what I'm taking from comments in the trailer. So the Sulaco goes to Fury and comes back to LV-426...so obviously someone sent it back, with all those xenos on board(scene in the previous gameplay trailers the Sulaco looks like an alien nest on the inside) or something.

John_Stark

SargeISdead said:
Yeah I just watched that on the CM thread and honestly I'm even more confused now about the game and how they are going to tie it in to ALIENS and the series in general. From the look of things the crew on the Sephora already knows about the xenos before they get there, at least that's what I'm taking from comments in the trailer. So the Sulaco goes to Fury and comes back to LV-426...so obviously someone sent it back, with all those xenos on board(scene in the previous gameplay trailers the Sulaco looks like an alien nest on the inside) or something.

I think the sephora only knows about them after encountering them on the sulaco. Which i believe is the first level on the game, then they proceed to LV-426.

And i think Weyland is responsible for what happens on the sulaco over fury 161. Because he wants that ship, it has ties to the xenomorphs.

K_Price85

Back to the egg. Those cryo tubes were on the Sulaco and not the drop ship. You can see the EEV depart the Sulaco. I would say the opening of Alien 3 may contain one of the biggest plot holes of all time. I still enjoy the film though.

The facehugger was deemed a super-facehugger(2 embryos, one being a queen) in the Assembly Cut. It was only shown briefly and didn't describe what it was in the film.

SargeISdead

K_Price85 said:
Back to the egg. Those cryo tubes were on the Sulaco and not the drop ship. You can see the EEV depart the Sulaco. I would say the opening of Alien 3 may contain one of the biggest plot holes of all time. I still enjoy the film though.

The facehugger was deemed a super-facehugger(2 embryos, one being a queen) in the Assembly Cut. It was only shown briefly and didn't describe what it was in the film.

Yeah that's basically what the expanded universe books say as well, if a face hugger hatches in a new area with no xeno population it can sort of "mutate" or evolve to carry two embryos, one for the Queen and the other for a drone to guard the Queen while it develops in the host, hence the xeno's behaviour towards Ripley and hostility to all the others.

John_Stark - it looks interesting either way, I'm really excited for the game to come out, the only thing that looked a little odd was seeing all the Marines with their hardware rolling out on LV-426, because most of the first few game trailers show the ships crashing to the surface of LV-426 after the airlock bridge is destroyed. Honestly can't wait to see what they do with it story wise.

John_Stark

SargeISdead said:

K_Price85 said:
John_Stark - it looks interesting either way, I'm really excited for the game to come out, the only thing that looked a little odd was seeing all the Marines with their hardware rolling out on LV-426, because most of the first few game trailers show the ships crashing to the surface of LV-426 after the airlock bridge is destroyed. Honestly can't wait to see what they do with it story wise.

Maybe we play as 2 different crews. I can't see the first one surviving that crash.

But alright back to the egg.

Yeah, it's an issue, even though i like alien 3. I'll wait to see if they actually elaborate an answer on this game (which i hope they do, since fox is making it canon) but if they don't there's not much we can do to make it seem reasonable.

K_Price85

I hope someone produces a short movie all the cut scenes of Colonial Marines. Hopefully it can come up with some answers. Alien 3 could have been so much more.

Dancing_Frog

Taking about the egg on Sulaco. At the end of the credits on the Laserdisc Special Edition of Aliens, there was the sound of a facehugger skittering around which some moron took to mean that there was facehugger on the Sulaco. It was the same moron that thought that the line, "it looks like the new Lieutenant is too good to eat with the rest of us," referred to Warrant Officer Ripley rather than Gorman. And thus, Lieutenant Ripley was born.

The egg was in the far corner of the mess hall on the Sulaco which was a highly unlikely spot for it to have been placed by a queen that was literally never out of sight on the Sulaco. And it's extraordinarily doubtful that Ripley with her extensive experience with these bastards would not have gone through the Sulaco compartment by compartment before going to sleep as well as sealing off the hypersleep chamber. The beginning sequence was complete rubbish.

The rest of the movie was such a major disappointment that when Alien 4 was announced there was a large contingent pushing for Alien 3 to be just one of Ripley's bad dreams in hypersleep.

In retrospect, there was no way they could go big with the story for the third movie, because Fox wasn't willing to front the money for a big story. In fact, Sigourney Weaver had throw her weight around just to get it finished, and Fox was dismantling sets on David Fincher just to prevent him from going over schedule on primary photography. Considering all that, it was probably the best movie they could do at the time.

John_Stark

Yet, even with all it's faults i can safely say that at least Alien 3 was NOT like Alien resurrection.

Jesus Christ, is that movie bad. I would rather watch AVP than watch that one. And AVP isn't even part of the alien universe, says how much i love A:R

Dancing_Frog

John_Stark said:
Yet, even with all it's faults i can safely say that at least Alien 3 was NOT like Alien resurrection.

Jesus Christ, is that movie bad. I would rather watch AVP than watch that one. And AVP isn't even part of the alien universe, says how much i love A:R

Yeah, I can agree with that sentiment. Just be careful with the AVP's. Anything with ":R" after it really sucks regardless of the universe it's in.

John_Stark

Dancing_Frog said:
Anything with ":R" after it really sucks regardless of the universe it's in.

Actually there might be one exception. I really liked underworld: rise of the lycans. I thought it was the best Underworld movie.

Terraformer

I love alien 3 but yeah it does have one major plot hole but the opening was freaky as hell. Too bad studio's never let fincher have his own film and make his own story. but what doesn't kill you makes you stronger. has he even worked for fox ever since?

ummester

Now, if we include Prometheus, in a way all of the Alien films are kind of stand alone. The only one that is a true continuation is Aliens to Alien but even they are totally different films with one being action and the other horror orientated.

It is an interesting franchise, in that sense, that each film is kind of unique.

As for the egg on the Sulaco - perhaps it was always there? or perhaps the company got it up there somehow. If I recall in Alien 3, Bishop was kind of mean - perhaps he got an egg on board somehow? Even though he was acting all heroric in Aliens, he may have been a duplicitous company bot all along.

redphoenix

I just thought, maybe the company threatend to dissasenble Bishop if he mentioned the egg. Far out, but plausible.

K_Price85

I just don't see how and why Bishop would have placed the egg all sideways near the ceiling. I also think, had the egg been explained. The film would have done way better in terms of positive reviews. I know people who refuse to watch the film because of the egg. Who knows, maybe Burke flipped the switch. I would have made a lot more sense had they shown the egg on the drop ship hatch ala super-facehugger and find its way into the cryotube area. Only a few seconds could have erased one of the most talked about things of the series.

@ummester

That's another big debate as to whether or not that Bishop was an android or human. Some say you can see red blood. You can imagine how the AVP faithful feel about having a human Lance Henriksen in Alien 3.

Terraformer

James Cameron showed interest in making a third film but he was busy with Terminator 2 and True lies and Fox wouldn't wait. Ridley Scott was refused flat out for unknown reasons even though he wanted to return and do a film focused on the space jockeys and the origin of the alien creatures.

After alien 3 they rushed into making a fourth film and sigourney only agreed because of $$$$.

After that she was in talks of doing a new film with Ridley as director and Cameron as both writer and producer but Fox instead went with AVP.

The alien prequel was greenlit and given a date to when filming will begin and this was even before a script was fully completed by spaihts and just 4 months before production was to begin, Lindelof made his script which the fox C.E.O came up with the name Prometheus.

They did re-writes till the very day the filming began. so prometheus you could say was rushed.

So every alien film after aliens suffered the same type of fate = the film was greenlit and given a date before a script was even written. But I'd say prometheus came out better than the others. 20th century fox is notorious for rushing people with films and not giving them enough time in the developing stage before moving them to the filming stage

John_Stark

I've got the answer to why the egg was there the whole time...are you ready?

Really? Are you?

It was deposited by David Fincher's eggsack. Apparently he was left on the set way too often and he just had to go, so he did it right there.

It was all real.

ummester

Terraformer said:
So every alien film after aliens suffered the same type of fate = the film was greenlit and given a date before a script was even written. But I'd say prometheus came out better than the others. 20th century fox is notorious for rushing people with films and not giving them enough time in the developing stage before moving them to the filming stage

I agree but it is always an niggling annoyance with me that none of the films from Aliens forward were given the oppurtunity to come out as good as they could have.

Still, like being a published author and having to suck up the publishers edits, we all work for the man (including big name directors like Ridley). The man pays the bills and we abide by the man's choices because, in the end, we can always blame him for anything that goes wrong:)

meshuggah

^ Agreed, ah poor Fincher, he did the best he could under all the executive pressure, it's a miracle a film came out at all after all that development hell. I'm looking forward to Colonial Marines I can tell you.

LORDofLOGIC

Colonial Marines has it's work cut out for it to try and explain the train wreck that was Alien 3... The Bishop in Alien 3 would most likely have been a clone of Charles Bishop Weyland from AVP.

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